[Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Info about Mabinogi game updates from around the world.
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Kapra

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Kapra »

Soluna wrote:Fight them like a man <_<... or run like a coward...
Okay. *turns around and runs while screaming and waving arms*
Soluna wrote:Is a needed fix I suppose, because the bot issue was very serious in the eastern servers.

More and more RO everyday...
Wouldn't they just drown down each others' prices that way?...
Kapra

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Kapra »

By the way, whats the new Homestead content? Just a few trees?
Soluna

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Soluna »

Psy wrote:By the way, whats the new Homestead content? Just a few trees?
They already patched G16S2 a few days ago and I purposely chose not to update on it because the only thing added was G1~3 for elf/giant, everything has been pushed back to 4/12, that means no bards or combat change or whatever they have up in their sleeves etc.

As for G1~G3, yes... they didn't change storyline at all, Elf/Giant just get their falcon/beast transform through G2, which is just plan weird when it hits G3. On the plus side, elf and giants don't need to do transformation quest anymore, so start tossing them gargoyle statues I suppose... Other differences are just the minor ones: removing certain day-only dungeon, needed to wait an hour before next quest etc adding exp/gold reward to the quests...

As for the three 100% enchant scrolls, they are special event reward for completing G1~3 respectively with in event time.

Other than that, they have also reduced the keyword functions such that you don't "need" to use the keyword to talk to NPC. As long as you have the keyword, talking them normally works also.

I dunno, I didn't think anything in S2 had content much to begin with and the only thing I see that's great was the removal of the Tir Chonaill Auto Map Feature.
I figured I'd take a break from it because there's nothing interesting so don't expect much info since I am now in EO.
Kapra

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Kapra »

Soluna wrote:As for G1~G3, yes... they didn't change storyline at all, Elf/Giant just get their falcon/beast transform through G2, which is just plan weird when it hits G3. On the plus side, elf and giants don't need to do transformation quest anymore, so start tossing them gargoyle statues I suppose... Other differences are just the minor ones: removing certain day-only dungeon, needed to wait an hour before next quest etc adding exp/gold reward to the quests...
Wait, so can Elves and Giants whom already had the transformation from the previous quest line be able to do G1 and/or G2?
Soluna

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Soluna »

Psy wrote: Wait, so can Elves and Giants whom already had the transformation from the previous quest line be able to do G1 and/or G2?
You can pick which one to start at, even if you already completed the old one, which means yea... run it again. They have also added in AP rewards for G1 quests to encourage people doing them and lower the difficulty of the quests like making 3-Warrior RP dungeon able to enter with only 1 person, completely removing things like Goro's ring quest etc... If you already have the trans skill though they will probably be disabled in the story dungeons much like old days with G1.
Aeril

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Aeril »

I went through about six pages worth of comments and didn't find anything constructive in terms of feedback about the skill change, so here goes.

DevCat is going in a great direction with this proposed change(I consider test server to be proposed, no ring is out yet). Mabinogi has for some time been severely lacking in forcing players to move away from tried and true dogmas. Windmill, Magnum, Smash(seriously, some of my guild members swear by smash), etc. The main problem I'm seeing is implementation here.

Melee has grown a bit stale over time without any reason to combo moves together. Does anyone else recall having to use smash > counter > defense > melee > windmill and so on? That's because our damage and abilities have grown, but the potential of the enemies hasn't. We found a rut(admittedly it's a really good rut) and hopped right into it. Counterattack still exists. Defense feels unappreciated. When was the last time you actually used charge in a PvE situation? Not even mentioning other things like Stomp, Wind Guard, Taunt, and (heaven preserve us) Final Hit. We don't use them because we haven't TRIED recently. In our defense we didn't need to, but still, this change would quickly force us to revitalize the game and possibly think while killing that enemy. Also there are lances, but I don't even want to go there.

One thing I'm cautious about as an archer is range. We don't exactly have...a lot of skills. At least not a lot of poke poke skills. You have normal range, granted. You have magnum, the end all of the archer. Crash Shot is spectacular...although a bit situational for my taste. And humans have Arrow Revolver which from what I hear is slightly less than stellar in PvE(playing as an elf I don't have occasion to know).

The thing is, that's about it.

Oh sure, we have Support Shot. The skill that makes the first melee attack within a time period gets an extra 70% damage. Which if you do the math is somewhere between a third and a whole lot less damage than I could do with magnum. Or hell, normal range. In addition the shot will never knock back, knock down, and does reduced damage.

Also we have Mirage Missile(and by we I mean elves). Give that no load time and I might actually use it again, 200% damage at r1 for just the arrow isn't terrible. The problem is that the arrow doesn't actually stun for long.

Also we have Final Shot, but that's not...actively killing anything. It makes me look cool while shooting your face in rapidly for thirty seconds.

The only way to effectively implement the new combat system without utterly destroying range would be to alter a lot of the skills, add new skills, and for the love of god reduce cooldown time for magnum. Even humans as they are now don't take four seconds to load the thing, so a four second cooldown for elves is ridiculous. Unless they can implement new range skills along with the season itself(doubtful), or significantly alter the numbers I've seen so far, range will be fairly worthless on any higher level creatures for at least one season. (Please note that I DO NOT EVER PVP. None of what I said is in reference to PvP and is all in reference for a level 2xxx mainly range elf in PvE situations.)

Magic and Alchemy aren't even getting modified from what I've gathered, so I'll just skip them for now.


To continue on, races need rebalancing as Soluna pointed out earlier.
They need it badly.

Elves are range, or supposed to be, yet they lack the ability to use Arrow Revolver. Giants are melee, but they can't hold two swords or use Final Hit(I can see the reasoning behind that but still). Humans are meant to be a median race but they dominate most fields of the game. If you honestly asked me I'd say that humans were favored, elves second most, and giants are the unwanted children, which is just unfortunate.

Bright side: Elves and giants can do G1(maybe G2 as well not sure about that).
BRAVO! THANK YOU FINALLY SOMEONE MADE MY DREAM A REALITY!!

Not so bright side: The new combat system is basically screwing us over so badly that I can't think of a proper metaphor for it.

The thing is that we have four current combat....ish...type things in Mabinogi: Melee, Magic, Range, and Alchemy.

Giants are good at melee, so make them good at it(better than humans)
Elves are good at range, so make them good at it(better than humans)
Humans AND Elves are good at magic, Giants aren't so hot on the thinking thing.
So the obvious solution(much as it pains me as an elf to say it) is to make Humans and Giants better at alchemy than Elves.
It's a perfect workaround that allows Humans to be a median race as intended and for Elves and Giants to really shine in their own areas.
Also, certain racial bonus skills suck(coughWindGuardMiragecough) in comparison to other racial bonus skills (coughFinalHitArrowRevolvercough).
Please fix it.
Also Paladins need a transformation skill (go with a goddess sword or something, make it cool for the poor blighters).
Also Dark Knights need a GOOD transformation skill. Seriously. They can tame stuff using scrolls instead of bait and a staff.
....it kinda sucks for them.

I'm a bit too tired to actually think more clearly at this point, so I'll kind of crash to a stop here. I'll be on to debate finer points of this post(read: probably pretty much everything I said) when I'm not actively dying.


~Aeril
Kapra

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Kapra »

Aeril wrote:Bright side: Elves and giants can do G1(maybe G2 as well not sure about that).
BRAVO! THANK YOU FINALLY SOMEONE MADE MY DREAM A REALITY!!
Soluna sort of confirmed G2-3.
Soluna

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Soluna »

Aeril wrote: DevCat is going in a great direction with this proposed change(I consider test server to be proposed, no ring is out yet). Mabinogi has for some time been severely lacking in forcing players to move away from tried and true dogmas. Windmill, Magnum, Smash(seriously, some of my guild members swear by smash), etc. The main problem I'm seeing is implementation here.
It is testing, and they are still sorting things out, which is why it is moved to 4/12 as the update.

I am not an advocate of implement the system nor against it. The only thing I did was stating what the system was doing, which is limiting people from spamming certain skill in terms of melee combat, and that I agree to some extend it should be controlled. And if they were intending to do prevent the skill spams with that plan it does it very well.

The only thing I have against were the people claiming the combat system used to be unique and that this kills combat with all their DPS non-sense. The bottom-line is if it is a Rock Paper Scissor system, DPS is something shouldn't even come into question at ALL. If Rock does more damage than Scissor are you going to use Rock against Paper? No... you are not! The problem is that in the RPS system damage should not be an issue, it is which correct skill you should use in countering against the enemy skill, not brainlessly use Magnum, Windmill, or Flameburst that ignores the system completely, that is the contradiction people draw themselves to, so no, I don't think the system is unique at all, at least not now, maybe back in G1 it was.

As for the race balance issues, I am just gonna skip thats that's one of my "The 10 most controversial arguments on Mabi to Avoid", yea...
Psy wrote: Soluna sort of confirmed G2-3.
Not sort of, more like stated G2-3 is there, with new animation file for giants stopping price from being stepped to rubble and all.
Craddle

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Craddle »

Psy wrote:By the way, whats the new Homestead content? Just a few trees?
Same thing I've been wondering.
Zeo

Re: [Testing] G16S2 Bard Destiny

Post by Zeo »

I hope the cool-down combat system get massively altered before it get released to the public, or even scrap it out.

The cool-down was too harsh for Melee and Ranged skills.

I'd be up for the cool-down system if they did it the opposite way... Load time takes 0 second to load for skills, but the cool-down would have the time it used to load the skills.

Like... smash would have 0 seconds to load, but 1.5 seconds of cool-down.

But there is few skills I think should still have cool-down remain, such as Arrow Revolver, for 10 seconds, so it doesn't get abused too much, especially for PvP.


And as for homstead contents... I'm wondering about that as well.
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